FIRE, also known as Financial Independence/Retire Early, has caught the attention of some major mainstream media outlets over the past few years and I can’t say it’s been welcomed with open arms.
Hate is a strong word and a good chunk of the population, myself included, were taught not to even use it as a child. As an adult, I use it as I see fit and to convey emotion. The case of FIRE is no exception. And with that, let’s jump into the 5 things I hate about the FIRE movement.
1. A Shift Away From Finance
In recent months I’ve noticed a major shift in the FIRE movement away from personal finance and toward life coaching, happiness, and goal-setting. Now, there isn’t anything wrong with any of the latter, it’s just that I’m not sure how much they have to do with personal finance other than another money-making avenue for some influencers.
I mean, let’s face it, you can only write about how to save money on toilet paper so many times before you need a new angle. I guess that new angle is selling products that make people feel warm and fuzzy, despite how much debt they have or how little money in their retirement accounts.
2. Romanticizing Side Hustles
Can you hear me rolling my eyes right now? I am so incredibly sick and tired of hearing the majority of people in the FIRE movement tout the benefits of side hustles.
Yes, there are benefits to having a side hustle. There are also downsides – HUGE downsides. Those downsides come in the form of less time and energy to spend on yourself or nurturing relationships with the people you love.
When I started this blog back in 2015, I didn’t realize it was going to eat up so much of my time for so little return. That little return was exactly ZERO dollars until 2017 when I started to make at least enough money to cover my monthly expenses.
After I started earning money I ramped it up and was working upwards of 40 hours each week on the blog. That’s in addition to my full-time corporate job. Obviously, that wasn’t sustainable and I started to really not enjoy my life. My evenings and weekends were packed with content creation, social media promotion, and countless other tasks necessary to keep my one-woman show running.
Do you know what my weekends weren’t packed with? Relaxation and quality time with my family. For the amount of money I was making, it simply wasn’t worth what I was missing out on.
Since then, I turned the dial way back and am now much happier creating only content I think my audience will benefit from in one of three ways: motivation, inspiration, and entertainment. I’m leaving the 10 ways to make a budget and mastermind courses to the other folks.
So here I am, going off on a tangent like I sometimes do. The bottom line is that side hustles are, by definition, on the side of (read: in addition to) a full-time job. That isn’t easy and it’s a quick ticket to burn out. Buyer beware.
3. Demonization Of Corporate Jobs
Oh my gosh, the fluorescent lights over my cubicle are sucking the life out of me. I can’t even imagine going into that awful place and functioning in such a horrid condition for decades to come. PSYCHE. I really couldn’t care less about the fluorescent lights at work. In fact, I believe my company switched completely over to energy-efficient and dimmable LEDs. But even if they hadn’t, I still wouldn’t mind.
I have always been a glass half full kinda gal and when it comes to my corporate job and benefits, I’m no different.
Sure, there was a brief period of time when some of the top FIRE influencers had me convinced I was dying a slow death under those fluorescent lights. And then, I engaged my brain.
Not only was I NOT dying, I actually enjoyed those fluorescent lights and everything that came along with them. Like, you know, my corporate benefits including healthcare, a generous matching 401k plan, and a pension. I was also grateful for my salary and the relationships with like-minded individuals with similar backgrounds and histories.
I’m not talking out against diversity here. What I’m trying to convey is how important the relationships are that I have with some of my colleagues. I have a very good friend who is a professor and Doctor of Psychology who takes every chance possible to remind me that when human beings are without distraction, their thoughts automatically default to their relationships.
I know having work relationships isn’t true for everyone, but I’m willing to bet the majority of people out there can relate to what I’m saying. The adult workplace is just an extension of school and the main place where relationships are formed.
With all of that, hopefully, you can understand why I get a sour taste in my mouth whenever I hear people bash the very jobs that are allowing them to buy organic food, heat their homes, save for retirement – whether it be early or traditional, and make lasting friendships.
Related:
- Episode 27 // 5 Things We Hate About The FIRE Movement
- Why We Stopped Chasing Early Retirement For A Happier Life
- Extreme Frugality Fatigue Is A Thing
- Why You Should Feel Fabulous Even If You’re Deep In Debt
- How My Perspective Of The FIRE Movement Changed After Turning 40
4. Unrealistic Nest Egg Suggestions
The FIRE movement touts a nest egg only needs to be large enough to cover your expected expenses in early retirement. Now, that is a true statement. However, when you’re attempting to gauge how much money you’re going to need to cover decades worth of expenses until reaching traditional retirement age, things can easily get overlooked.
Like, a future unexpected divorce, illness, or the desire to have children when the original plan was to fly solo or as a footloose and fancy-free couple. Other expensive and unexpected issues include fertility treatments, a forced move to an HCOL area, a recession, and on and on and on.
I’ve said this before and I’ll say it again, top FIRE influencers are usually earning a substantial income from their blogs, podcasts, etc., so they’re not necessarily pulling out 4% of their savings to fund a minimal lifestyle. In some cases, they’re not pulling money out at all. Instead, they’re earning a full-time income that is allowing them to continue to invest.
So what is an appropriate nest egg for someone who has their eyes set on FIRE? Well, it all depends. But know this, if you’re modeling your early retirement nest egg on that of a FIRE influencer, make sure you factor the money he or she makes from a blog, podcast, course, or the like into your calculations – especially if you plan on actually retiring (AKA ceasing to work) and not earning a supplemental/full-time income from an entrepreneurial venture.
5. Lack Of Transparency
On the heels of the nest egg conundrum, there is an obvious big black hole when it comes to transparency among FIRE bloggers. Don’t get me wrong, I’m not suggesting anyone provide bank account numbers or even net worth, but it would be nice to have a clear picture of how some early retirees are funding that retirement.
Of course, there is sampling bias at work here because FIRE influencers aren’t the only people around that are retiring early. They’re just the only people around retiring early and talking about it online. But, I also know how exciting it is to stumble upon the FIRE movement and how dazzling it can be to someone who isn’t as thrilled about their day job as I am.
This is where I believe FIRE influencers have an obligation to be as transparent as possible when it comes to retiring early. What does transparent as possible look like?
In my opinion, it looks like telling your audience whether you are or aren’t living off of the 4% rule. It looks like being open about your varying income streams during early retirement and what your plans are if your nest egg dwindles faster than expected.
Right or wrong, future FIREees tend to idolize top influencers and, in my opinion, those top influencers need to be as transparent as they can comfortably be with their audience.
As I mentioned in the past, I will forever be grateful for what the FIRE movement did for my motivation and money when I found it back in 2015. Since then, though, things have changed. Things have changed to be more cryptic. More about happiness and feelings and less about budgets and bottom lines.
I know things don’t stay the same and that change is inevitable with any movement, I just think the original FIRE is starting to die down.
My humble suggestion to anyone finding the FIRE movement today is to make sure you’re following influencers who are genuine and selling you only quality services or products, not just a dream.
49 Comments
Nice thoughts and I’ve often been guilty of #3. In hindsight, if I weren’t already financially independence I could have just taken a career break and found a workplace that isn’t toxic. Hate is a strong word for my corporate job, it was a very effective means to and end.
The shift away from finance and romanticizing side hustles kills me. I’m a believer in the 10,000 hour concept – it takes that long to master a skill. Any startup business/side hustle is going to be immensely frustrating until you get towards those 10,000 hours. From blogging to rental property, its an experience based business. All of these “near overnight success” bloggers…turns out its not their first blog!
Yeah, in my opinion, the majority of people underestimate what it takes to build up a side hustle into a real money-making venture. And that’s OK, but what irritates me is how many influencers push side hustles as a realistic option for most people to boost their incomes. And don’t even get me started on survey sites. š
Thank you for this post.
Many side hustles Iāve seen encouraged on blogs are very low $/hr.
Itās very rare to see on blogs the idea of staying a little longer at the main job instead of side hustling to quit earlier – it can be a lot higher $/hr and longer time with employer subsidized health insurance.
You make an excellent point about staying with a corporate/main job longer to achieve FIRE faster. Side hustles can be great for the right person but they definitely are not the only route to extra money, nor are they usually the fastest.
Blogging has to be the worst side hustle. Even worse than when I see people suggesting someone with a teaching degree tutor for $10/hour (clicking through a referral link, of course!). I’m always skeptical when side hustle suggestions come with referral links š
I couldnāt agree with you more. Blogging is the worst for making money quickly. Not only that but the learning curve to just get launched is insane. Thanks for commenting!
Great perspective. Obviously the math principles of FI/RE that encourage people to minimize expenses and maximize their savings are great, but the whole cultish mindset can be strange. I love my job! I get an opportunity to impact others in a way I couldn’t dream of doing with just lil ol’ me on my own.
Iām glad Iām not the only one seeing the ācult-ishā ways starting to appear. All the summits and retreats and cons are starting to be a bit heavy-handed. But I do agree that the basic principles of FIRE are great. Itās just a shame itās morphing into something a little less genuine. Thanks for stopping by.
The side hustle posts are so annoying and so prevalent! And they all say the same thing and act like you’re going to make a ton of money. There’s not much money to be made by answering surveys.
And freelance writing is always on the list. Writing is my full-time job so I know that not just anybody can get freelance writing jobs, at least not the well-paying ones. I made $65/hour for one of my freelance jobs, but I got the job because I used to work for the company and I was a known commodity. They would not have hired somebody off the street for that hourly rate. And as nice as the money was, I burned out and quit because it left no time for myself or for my family.
I follow FI blogs to get tips on how to budget and keep my costs in check. I’m not going to retire early because I’m already 57, so the typical side hustles that these blogs keep touting are not going to help me any way.
There sure isnāt money to be made taking surveys. And thatās experience talking. When I was forging my way as a single parent, I thought Iād try to my hand at surveys to earn some extra money because I could take them from the comfort of my own home. I canāt even begin to add up how many hours I spent just to make $50/month. So disappointing and misleading. To be fair though, I doubt a lot of bloggers suggesting survey sites have ever actually used survey sites.
Iām certainly not a writer by training, but I have also done some freelance writing in the past and the quality of work expected for such small payouts were disheartening.
Iām in my mid-40s now and after having a little more life experience than most PF influencers, I see the world through a different lens and know that even retiring at a traditional age with a comfortable nest egg is quite an accomplishment.
Thanks for stopping by and leaving such a thoughtful comment!
Just chiming in here about the surveys. I did do some when paying off debt, and while those $3 checks weren’t much, I do mention them because they were things I could easily do in a couple of minutes to make $3 I wouldn’t otherwise have. $3 for 2 minutes is a great return on time. I don’t have an entire article about taking surveys though, that’s for sure!
Thanks for chiming in! I love varying opinions.
I actually did have entire articles (okay, maybe one) on taking surveys. Youāre right, you can definitely earn money you wouldnāt otherwise earn, but itās not a huge money-makes. Some sites claim you can make up to $500/month. I canāt imagine what it would take to earn that much money in a single month.
Preach!! Especially about the side hustles. Everyone is different, obviously, but for me, FIRE is about more time — truly my most valuable commodity — so the idea of a side hustle kills that. I feel that there are a bunch of people out there running themselves ragged to make a few extra bucks, and not enjoying the time that they have in the here and now. And not to be morbid, but I have seen too many people I know lose loved ones very, very young, and so I focus on a balance between securing my future and retiring soon, but ALSO enjoying my life now. Tomorrow is not a guarantee.
Thanks for this post, I hope people take it to heart.
I always get a chuckle when someone says, āpreachā to me. Youāre not the first so I must do so quite often. Haha.
Side hustles can be great but there is such potential for one to eat up oneās valuable free time for very little return. Experience talking here.
I, too, have seen young and seemingly healthy people have their lives turned upside down in an instant due to unexpected health issues. Youāre so right. Time truly is our most valuable asset.
Thanks for commenting!
I listened to your podcast and listen to other FIRE podcasts and yours really resonates with me. I was pretty obsessed when I first found FIRE (only a few months ago) but now I see some things that don’t sit well. I don’t really understand how someone in their early 30’s, young babies, just paid off huge debt can be FIRE already. It seems that some just hate their jobs, want out fast, say they’re RE, but are now using the ‘movement’ to make money. It’s not the worst thing in the world, it just seems disingenuous. Not sure why we all have to LOVE our jobs anyway. I appreciate those that focus on being smarter with money, saving/investing better, etc. There is no short cut to FIRE. It takes time (20 years in my case) and those that say they’re FIRE with the plan to live on 26K/year doesn’t make sense to me.
Thanks for sharing your perspective on FIRE. I appreciate your perspective. One last thing, I am so confused by how people are travel hacking. yes, I’ve gotten a cc to get a sign up bonus here and there but how does that allow me to travel the world for FREE year after year. Thanks for letting me vent. I needed a place to do so. LOL.
Thanks for listening to our podcast!
It sounds like youāre having the same revelations we had about the FIRE movement. I canāt see how people so young can retire on such low annual incomes. For me, I donāt want to just get by and have to scrutinize every purchase.
Our goal is to enjoy our lives both now and later. Balance is the name of our financial game š
Superb article! Agreed on each and every pint!
Thank you so much!
I’m about a year in to my FI journey and I’ve definitely settled down into a slow and steady mode instead of the frantic, all-consuming mode I was in when I first found FIRE. I got sucked into thinking I MUST have a side-hustle in addition to my 9-5 so I tried surveys and such and came to terms with it not being worth my time. I did start a blog but not as a side hustle, just as a creative outlet. Now I like to read other FI blogs to stay inspired, keep learning, and of course be entertained š So thanks for keepin’ it real and putting out great posts!
Oh, wow, does that sound so familiar to me! Thanks for the thoughtful comment and the compliment. š
I hate the glossing over of health insurance in early retirement. Tanja Hester is a notable exception as is physician on fire.
I agree. It is something that is typically glossed over – probably because a lot of folks are on the younger side. Kudos to Tanja and POF for also telling it like it is and giving great insight into healthcare options post early retirement. Thanks for stopping by and for your comment!
Ok, someone else said “preach!” so I’ll have to go with “testify!” Thanks for saying that about demonizing corporate jobs. I loved my corporate job, it allowed me to accomplish things I could have never done otherwise. It was cool to fly on corporate jets, testify before the House and then before Senate in DC, watch my CEO ring the bell on Wall Street, make more money in a year than I could have ever imagined, present keynote speeches to thousands of people. And maybe best of all save a life with CPR. How is all that not fun!
YES! That sounds like an interesting, fulfilling, and fun career! Thanks for stopping by and leaving such an insightful comment!
Yeees! I was really excited about FIRE when I first learned about it, but there are a lot of things that bother me about it, like:
— The whole “redefining retirement” thing. Like you said, it’s fine to have a hobby or even make money in retirement, but it’s disingenuous to say you’re “early retired” if you spend 30-50 hours a week blogging, creating online courses, etc.
— I see a lot of male bloggers in traditionally male-dominated industries (tech, etc.) talking about wanting to work less to spend time with their kids. That’s wonderful, but it seems like women are still stigmatized for wanting the same thing — as if it’s somehow okay to be an “early retired dad” but shameful to be a “stay-at-home dad.”
— There is definitely something a little cultish about it, especially how some influencers (like Mr. Money Mustache) are revered.
— I hate how FIRE bloggers refer to work and debt as “slavery.” Debt can be a real problem, but they act like having ANY debt is this horrifying burden that should be destroyed at any cost (even if it might make more sense, for example, to save more for retirement than pay off your student loans early).
All that said, there are some FIRE blogs I love, because they’re transparent and they cut a lot of the B.S. (especially Budgets Are Sexy).
Oh my gosh…so sorry it took me so long to respond but I’ve been crazy busy with the holidays, house guests, and my husband dealing with a bout of pneumonia. Thankfully, we all pulled through and are back to normal.
Budgets Are Sexy was one of the first blogs I found and it sucked me in. I loved the transparency and real-talk on the site. Obviously, I agree with all of your points and I’m so glad I’m not alone. Sometimes, it can be a little intimidating to write and talk about some of this stuff because it does seem a little cult-ish at times. That said, there are also a lot of good people in the community, like you mentioned.
And as far as debt goes, you’re right. Debt isn’t always a bad thing and sometimes it’s actually necessary. Not everyone can buy a car outright – even a crappy one. Everyone has a different starting point but that doesn’t make all debt bad. Thank you so much for your thoughtful comment!
I love all of this. I’ve said the same thing for years. I also really related to what you said about side hustles, and I personally think the whole “blogging for money” niche is the new MLM. I’m sure most people take a long ass time to earn anything from it, if they do at all.
To be completely transparent…I think it took me close to 2 years to make a dime. Sure, you can start a blog in 15 minutes, but you certainly can’t earn substantial money from it in a short amount of time. It’s work. Hard work. And it’s time-consuming work.
Loved this post. FIRE has never completely resonated with me because part of being debt free is being able to enjoy our money… for us that has looked like a few trips to Europe with our teen, and being able to have a date night most weeks. I value saving and would rather be able to fund our daughterās college education than retire early. That said, my DH aims to retire at 57 and we are working towards that for him!
Sounds like you have a wonderful grasp on your finances and what makes sense for your family. All too often FIRE folks look down on life’s luxuries, but I say, as long as you have your ducks in a row, it’s fine to live a little. And I’m with you. I would much rather pay for our daughter’s college education than retire early. Thanks for your comment!
I love this article. There are lots of things to love about the FIRE movement, but I completely agree that many blogs over-simplify the process and under estimate what you need and how long it will take to get there. I don’t think it’s necessary or to cut expenses to the point that you’re miserable. I love your perspective (I’m also Gen X) and I’ll be reading more of your blog!
Thanks so much for your kind words. Gen-X rocks! Haha. I’ll look forward to interacting more in the future!
Transparency is such a big thing, especially when it comes to the FIRE influencers who are actually making sizeable amounts of money from blogging. It kind of has that perverse incentive for them to make it sound like everything is perfect and better.
And you’re right about work, while my day job can be boring, it’s way more fulfilling than anything else I could do right now. I like to blog and make graphs to validate to myself that I could do something if I were to early retire. I have some fears that I’d just sit and watch TV all day.
I love that you fear sitting around watching TV all day long. I think I could fall into the same trap. At some point, though, that might be OK. š
Finally, someone giving voice to the less crazies! I’ve come to resent the culture built around the FIRE community. Reading the comments sections on their blogs, sometimes you’d think that you’re a terrible person if you’re not an ascetic monk with a real estate side hustle putting every other last penny into a total market index fund. Blech. Boring vanilla lifestyle. Thanks for giving flavor again to this FI thing
Awe, thank you so much for the complimentary words. I do try to tell it like I see it and not sugar-coat anything. Life is too short to enjoy your money along the way. Saving money is great but not to the point that you miss out on the here and now.
This! I’m a financial planner and I just don’t understand the appeal of living on nothing now so you can live on nothing later. Also, people who are doing this are strategically NOT investing in their retirement accounts so they can invest in taxable accounts (so they can pull out of them before 59.5) but if they stop their FIRE goals or keep having earned income they would have been much better off in tax-advantaged accounts. Lastly, the 4% rule ONLY works historically over a 30 year time period, not a 50 or 60-year horizon. Anyway, thanks for being a dissenting voice.
Thank you for your thoughtful comment. I definitely try to take FIRE with a grain of salt these days. No one can argue with the basic principles of saving as much as possible, paying down debt, and living within your means. But, it’s certainly not a one-size-fits-all kind of thing and I’d hate to miscalculate and have to return to the workforce in a compromised position. I know my opinion is not a popular one, as you mentioned, but I stand by it.
I agree about being tired of some of the same things you are. Like you, I don’t agree that some of the FIRE goals the younger folk have are sustainable long-term. Maybe that’s because I remember the past few recessions and their drops too well. If they’re willing to work again, they’ll be fine, provided they can find work in a down economy. Again, I remember witnessing all the job losses and subsequent months or even years it took some to find work again and how they took far less pay for those jobs.
I also agree about how time consuming side hustles are, which is why I put so little into this concept. (My blog is a labor of love because I’ve always enjoyed writing. It earns next to nothing.) I have a few, but they’re not time consuming in the least, nor would they sustain me. My primary “side hustle” is picking up overtime at my current job. Nothing else pays as well.
Lastly, I’d like to see some more transparency too. Granted, I’m not all that transparent, but I’m still on my journey and am not far from FI. I’m also 40, childfree, and have been saver/investor since age 14. That said, I’ll still work once I reach FI because I like my job, have great benefits, and fear an unexpected health problem could wipe me out. Mostly, I just want to reduce my hours. But I love steady income! That said, I will not work full-time to age 65, unless I’ve found something I absolutely love.
Thanks so much for stopping by and for commenting. I know I ruffled some feathers with this post but the intent was truly just to caution others who are just finding FIRE to take some things with a grain of salt. There is a lot of transparency out there and the opposite is also true. Like you, I will continue to work as long as possible after hitting FI because I’m fearful of a health issue or other unexpected catastrophe that could wipe me out. I’m not sure why so many people hate their day jobs so much. š
I respect your perspective in this article. The FIRE community talks about many many things but I donāt think thereās an expectation that you should embrace and follow every single thing that the community shares. I for one do not hate my job but absolutely LOVE the idea of being FI. How I get there is entirely UP TO ME. No one is forcing me to have a side hustle, no one is forcing me to starve myself to death and certainly nobody is forcing me to use the 4% rule. In the end is up to me to listen and just take what I think works for our personal situation. I know that FIRE bloggers make money. Thatās not a new thing. Is it wrong? Who am I to be the judge of that. Your path is your path and you get to decide what that should look like. No blogger, influencer or movement should decide that for you. Like I said, I respect your opinion. I donāt necessarily agree with all your points but thatās the beauty of having differences of opinion especially in the context of PERSONAL finance.
Thank so much for your thoughtful comment. I agree that finance is personal and that we each choose our path and destiny based on the principles we embrace.
Great article….it’s good to view FIRE from all sides. I think the main draw for the FIRE concept for me is the core value that can be found in seeing something in a vastly different way than you were “taught” for years. This has given me huge motivation (not to mention hope…not a little thing)! As someone who is not even remotely close to reaching “FIRE”, I am still drawn to many aspects of the movement…for example living more simply, thinking outside the box regarding travel (even if travel hacking only truly helps me for 1 or 2 years at a time, there are still very memorable experiences there!), and the freedom of more options/choices. I take the things from it I think will work for me…and this has opened my world more. Life feels more calm, I feel more empowered, and most importantly I feel more in control of my financial life.
Thanks for this great article! I found the FIRE movement right after I graduated from college and it gave me an amazing head start. I became disenchanted about a year ago when I started having panic attacks, felt pressured into extreme frugality and a side hustle, and could cut anymore out from my budget. I really like my job and I recognize that it will be nice to have choices when we have kids or I want to take a step back from my career. I also feel like the whole thing has gone through a corporate makeover in the past 2 years and itās become smoke and mirrors. I love the financial path it set me on but the movement just feels icky to me now. I will say that my dad will be able to retire 5 years early from FIRE which he is extremely excited for.
You are so right, there are some voices and teachings in the FIRE community that just aren’t helpful. Anytime I recommend blogs to friends I always give a huge caveat. FIRE bloggers are writing as a character, a fictional person, not everyday people. Just like our instagram or FB pages there is a certain amount of editing that occurs. It’s not real. I love the reasons behind FIRE though and don’t see myself quitting the blogs or podcasts anytime soon!
I really appreciate and like this post! A great reminder of critical thinking skills and the importance of transparency. For sure……
Thanks for writing it!!
Thank you for writing this! I was starting to make myself feel bad for not having a side hustle after reading sooo many blogs about how great side hustles are. I was also starting to make myself feel bad for just having a regular 9-5 job and not something more āglamorousā or āentrepreneurialā.
Iām so happy I came across your article because it really helped me see that not everything is as always as perfect as someone makes it seem. It can be easy to forget that, especially through the internet.
Itās hard to not compare our real life to other peoples highlight reel. Glad I could help. š